PROJECT CAR: Mk1 Golf GTI 1.8T Track Car

[qta4]

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-VVW-151&Category_Code=VVWTK

Yes i have finally ordered bigger turbo from USA

Only weak link may be driveshafts.

Will be using 3" VR6 Maf housing,440 cc injectors and electronic boost control.
May also have to reinforce front of car to firewall.
Target 275 whp.
Will post progress
 

[Filx]

Awesome Noel. Keep us posted on the ATP kit and your feedback.

[qta4]

I have been deliberating for months, read every forum all over the world, translated Euro forums, trying to find and compare,separate bulls**t from fact.
After every consideration, i have come back to this set up.
Looking forward to having fun

[Filx]

Sounds fantastic. So supporting hardware upgrades also - 550cc injectors and a re-map? Compression drop or water injection to control pre ignition?

[qta4]

No,No,
Low end torque could be destructive to drive train, so will be using Giac software i have at the moment, electronic boost controller to limit boost in lower gears.

May rebuild quaife gearbox to install VR6 final drive to 3.36,

THis project will not produce max performance day one.
Lots of learning to get final potential.
Methanol/water injection is also in the mix.

Could be similar fun to original conversion.

I have to be carefull as we are getting close to max conrod tolerance.

New rods are in my new revised household budget, dont tell Bev

[RS ZWEI]

Awesome Noel!

Keep us up to date 

[robh]

No,No,
Low end torque could be destructive to drive train, so will be using Giac software i have at the moment, electronic boost controller to limit boost in lower gears.

May rebuild quaife gearbox to install VR6 final drive to 3.36,

THis project will not produce max performance day one.
Lots of learning to get final potential.
Methanol/water injection is also in the mix.

Could be similar fun to original conversion.

I have to be carefull as we are getting close to max conrod tolerance.

New rods are in my new revised household budget, dont tell Bev

I've run water injection before and it was ok, but your far better off getting the correct amount of fuel in and running a sensible CR/Boost/Timing configuration.  Keep it simple

[Filx]

Not to hijack this thread but for my 2c I disagree that one is better off with a lower CR and softer tuning than water injection. Like anything though it's got to be a part of the overall package and it does add some complexity (and risk) for sure - and ultimately I guess will depend on what the user wants out of the car.

But bear in mind a higher CR will make for a more "lively" car off boost and the extra exhaust gas energy will help spool a bigger turbo earlier. Making it potentially a good option for street cars that rarely use the full power but lug around at low boost/low rpm often.

[qta4]

The gt28rs is 350hp capable, but i dont want to tune to that level.
I will be limiting boost, using recommended injectors and chip.
My target is sub 300hp but just want the potential to go further if necesssary in the future.

I know absolutely nothing about water or water/methanol injection , so will learn if neccesary.

This is not the most powerful setup, but uses original exhaust manifold, in fact bolts on.

Some tuners have 400 plus hp on race gas with larger setups.

The new turbo is less expensive than a standard kkk 04 turbo

Should be fun

[Hoff]

this sounds cool, good luck

[M]

Noel,

Will need to get that phone chat with you at some point  . I actually had an ATP kit in UK 3 years ago now but sold it on to someone so never got to fit it. Was a very good "looking" kit though. 

As for the water injection debate, I have used it on a Supercharged engine and to be honest it is only good as a detonation deterant, it doesn't make more power. We ran it on a car with boost to run stock compression and it served it's purpose. We found that with the slight drop in CR(very slight to be honest) and a the already in place HUGE intercooler we lost all use for the feature. I would only ever use WI as a safety feature and wouldn't use it as part of tuning as such. Example: when inlet temps are above 50ishC and on boost then WI activate to prevent det,  the point being if your cooling is adequate then no need. If you are using it as part of your tuning method you will probably need a rather large water tank too....... 

Just for another slight point on compression, running higher CR DOES NOT mean the turbo will spool quicker(which is actually technically known as boost threshold and not turbo lag as is commonly thought, turbo lag is the amount of time it takes for a turbo to spool to boost when you are above the boost threshold). Higher CR WILL mean that off boost is more responsive, however the obvious trade-off is you can run more boost. The main thing with FWD is the transition from off boost to on, if you have low CR and high boost then the transition is severe, torque spike causes loss of traction, loss of traction increases revs, increase in revs increases boost and the cycle repeats.....  It's a fine line  hence we ran centrifugal supercharger in our 240bhp at wheels 1.6 FWD in UK and had phenomenal traction 

Cheers,
M

[Turbo]

My target is sub 300hp but just want the potential to go further if necesssary in the future.

sensible and mental all in the one sentence.
sounds choice.

[qta4]

i can assure readers of this post that this project will be completed as a fully researched, stage by stage.

I will install kit, with 440 cc injectors,electronic boost controller set real conservative,
run on dyno with VAG com log data.

I expect there will be issues, but will never stuff it up.
When i am happy with performance, who nows when that will be, it will be reliable and should run ok.

If i have to upgrade rods or even change from cast to forged crank, so be it.

To be honest, my biggest concern is designing structure to prevent front of car from tearing away from
firewall.

I doubt water injection will ever be needed as tune will be ok.
Plan to have EGT gauge also AF gauge,.

When the opportunity came to install 1.8t engine into mk1 golf ,many said it couldnt be done with factory ecu.

Well it works, works well, but now i need 100hp more at wheels, guess what it will happen next

[vwrally]

I can send photos of what we have done to the rally car if you like.

We have plates welded to the inner gaurds and bottom of the firewall.

[qta4]

Thanks , that would be great.
I spoke to a guy in usa who had customer run fully developed same turbo on MK1, front of car tried to tear itself from rest of car.